What did we veto?

Today in the House of Commons I asked the Prime Minister the following question:

Mark Reckless:Would the Prime Minister explain what it is that he’s vetoed?”

To which the Prime Minister responded:

Prime Minister: “I vetoed Britain’s involvement in a Treaty so as a result it is not an EU Treaty. We had in front of this House, we had the Maastricht EU Treaty, we had the Lisbon EU Treaty, we had Amsterdam, we had Nice. All of those were Treaties Britain was involved in as a member of the EU and they were EU Treaties with full force of law. This is not like that. This is outside the European Union. It is an arrangement come to by 25 other countries and we’re not involved, so as a result we’ve safeguarded Britain’s interest which could have been put at risk by a new EU Treaty.”

After all the huffing and puffing of December the make-up of the front-bench today – Nick Clegg smirking next to the PM with IDS staying away – said it all:

  1. We have not vetoed anything and at best have an opt-out;
  2. EU institutions are used by this treaty as with any other EU treaty; and
  3. We have no safeguards and the City is left wide open to EU regulation by majority vote.

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22 Comments

Filed under conservatives, david cameron, direct democracy, douglas carswell, europe, Mark In Westminster, mark reckless, People's Pledge, rochester and strood

22 responses to “What did we veto?

  1. We vetoed a full EU treaty amendment.

    We can’t stop the other EU members signing their own treaty.

    We are did not sign the new agreement so we are not bound by it.

    Who cares if they use EU institutions. We are not bound by it.

    You want a referendum. That is a reasonable position to hold, but many Eurosceptics, including myself, don’t. I don’t think we would win one and failing to do so would be used by Europhiles as an excuse to take us further into the EU.

    A referendum has nothing to do with the veto. You would make a much better case if you argued your point instead using your straw man argument over the veto.

    I wish Eurosceptics would concentrate on telling people why the EU is bad (like this), not on attacking other Eurosceptics. The British public might listen to us then.

  2. anthony scholefield

    A veto can only be exercised
    1o n a proposed treaty
    2.at an intergovernmental conference.

    None of these preconditions applied so David could not have execised his ‘veto’.
    What he did was explained by his spokesman as a ‘veto’ of the the proposal to put forward a new EU treaty but actually as has been pointed out by others tthis was not correct because a European Council works by majority vote .In fact David simply said that without the safeguards he asked for he would not be able to support a new EU treaty..

    We are now worse off because the new fiscal pact will at some point be brought into the EU and anyway ca be justiciable by the Court immediately

  3. The Question had to be asked, the fight to get a free vote on a EU referendum has to go on. The Danger from the EU running roughshod over our laws and enforcing it’s undemocratic will upon the unsuspecting people of England has never been more apparent. Keep up the fight Mark.

  4. iain

    My question which I’d like the PM to answer (and perhaps you, Mr Reckless, can ask…..when the time comes for this new ‘treaty’ to be incorporated into the existing treaties, (as Mrs Merkel expects), will such a move by whomever is PM at the time ensure that the much vaunted triple-lock for a EU referendum be activated.
    …or can the PM of the day get round that promise with more of the deceitful sleight of hand that we’ve all come to expect.

    • Ken Hall

      “or can the PM of the day get round that promise with more of the deceitful sleight of hand that we’ve all come to expect.”

      I believe that the answer to that question is yes. The referendum lock is specifically designed to lock the EU referendum away, never to be used. Even in the highly unlikely event that all the twisted and convoluted logic in the world fails to stop the requirement of a referendum, then the referendum would be limited to a specific item of EU law, NOT membership itself.

      All three Parliamentary parties are absolutely determined that the people of the UK must never be given a referendum on membership, unless and until continuous polls indicate that 80% of us want to stay in, or until we are so deeply integrated into a single de facto EU country that withdrawal would be actually impossible.

      I had hope that the conservatives might, just might, stand up for the interest of British voters, over the interest of the EU commission, European Council and EU Parliament.

      Sadly the only serious and credible party in UK politics which is dedicated to that task, and is also dedicated to actual conservative policies across the board, is UKIP.

      Mark, Please tell me how I can vote for a party which supports small government and low taxation. Who do I vote for to get that?

      How do I vote for a party who will massively simplify taxation so that large corporations can easily work out how much they actually owe and then pay it?

      How can I vote for a party who wants to rein in the politically correct thought police and allow freedom of thought and expression?

      How can I vote for a party who believes that all individual Brits are of equal value and should have equal rights based upon their actions, character and behaviour, regardless of colour, creed, religion, gender or sexual preference and so believe that political correctness is counter-productive, divisive and only serves to pit minority groups against each other.

      How can I vote for a party which will bring back grammar schools?

      How can I vote for a party which embraces real national democracy and who will introduce referendums with a Swiss-style system of local democracy?

      How can I vote for a party which will boost our defence, instead of cut it to the bone and will defend us strongly at home, but stop getting us involved in expensive foreign wars that have nothing to do with us?

      How can I vote for a party that will actually remove all the EU based red-tape and regulation and free small and medium sized businesses to achieve their potential?

      How can I vote for a party that will base their energy policy on real empirical evidence based science and not trendy and invalidated climate models?

      How can I vote for a party which will definitely withdraw from the terrorist and criminal protecting ECHR and replace it with an updated Bill of Rights which protects and supports the law abiding population?

      How can I vote for a party which will be tough on crime and criminals and issue real sentences, build more prisons which are tough, and crack down on crime properly?

      How can I vote for a party which is dedicated to reducing immigration properly?

      How can I vote for an anti-EU, pro Europe, Small Government, anti-PC divisiveness, low immigration, low tax, tough on crime, self reliance promoting party AND vote for the conservatives, who appear to be the opposite of those things?

      At the next election, do I vote for the labour lite policies of the social-democrat Conservatives? Or vote for policies I actually want?

      • I think we should be glad of the Internet and the freedom to actually discuss political issues with our fair minded M.P. I have just had an Epetition proposal rejected as a Joke and nonsense, where I proposed to make it illegal for public meetings concerning elections to only invite the top three parties candidates, as happened to me in Dover, and will happen in May in the London Mayor and GLA elections. I think they missed the point because by keeping them when it comes to discussing independence in Scotland they are the fourth party and will suffer from not having a voice in Scotland if same rules are applied. I asked for a Spirit of True and Fair Democracy to be upheld in public meetings, certainly something the EU will never allow !

  5. That’s an incredible amount of Twitter spam promoting this post, Mark.

  6. TFS

    I not sure whether you understand the financial markets? but try ZeroHedge website, or watch a couple of episodes of Max Keiser on Sky (RT).

    The financial markets are a criminal racket end of story, anyone whos says otherwise is dillusional! The markets have to be regulated, and people have to go to prison.

    in the words of one scottish actor ‘we are all doomed’.

  7. I am afraid we none of us know because the Cabinet Office has so far refused to release information about what was on the table in Brussels, the terms of the PM’s refusal (“veto”) and what it was he demanded in return for rolling over.

    While some of the damage coming to the City arises from arrangements agreed by the previous government and parliament, the abandonment of a Lisbon referendum allowed that treaty to pass and no powers wanted by the EU have yet been held up or recovered.

    If you allow all your opponents to caucus together you have lost as they have all the votes, resources and pressure and they can wait.

    As we used to say about Communists in East European elections – they only need win once, we have to win every time. So it is with the EU and Dave lost.

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  11. I would suggest you read the excellent book A Political Suicide by Norman Fowler relating to the last time the Conservatives were in government particularly on the subject of Europe. Your question yesterday needed to be dressed up as all I saw was a Euro Sceptic MP embarrassing a Conservative PM. It was quite dreadful and even more dreadful that you are so pleased with yourself. Oh well, Ed Miliband gained from yesterday – was this what you intended?

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  17. Oh Mark just noticed Damian Green will be giving a speech about Immigration today. I would like to draw your attention to my E petition http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/27683 which is designed to deter large employers from recruiting abroad cheaper foreign labour by increased Employers National Insurance contributions geared to allow those who have contributed for years a normal rate.

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